海角大神

A moment from years ago keeps replaying in Martin Scorsese鈥檚 mind.

When Akira Kurosawa was given an honorary Academy Award in 1990, the then 80-year-old Japanese filmmaker of 鈥淪even Samurai鈥� and 鈥淚kiru,鈥� in his brief, humble speech, said he hadn鈥檛 yet grasped the full essence of cinema.

It struck Mr. Scorsese, then in post-production on 鈥淕oodfellas,鈥� as a curious thing for such a master filmmaker to say. It wasn鈥檛 until Scorsese also turned 80 that he began to comprehend Mr. Kurosawa鈥檚 words. Even now, Mr. Scorsese says he鈥檚 just realizing the possibilities of cinema.

鈥淚鈥檝e lived long enough to be his age and I think I understand now,鈥� Mr. Scorsese said in a recent interview. 鈥淏ecause there is no limit. The limit is in yourself. These are just tools, the lights, and the camera and that stuff. How much further can you explore who you are?鈥�

Mr. Scorsese鈥檚 lifelong exploration has seemingly only grown deeper and more self-examining with time. In recent years, his films have swelled in scale and ambition as he鈥檚 plumbed the nature of faith (鈥淪ilence鈥�) and loss (鈥淭he Irishman鈥�).

His latest, 鈥淜illers of the Flower Moon,鈥� about the systematic killing of Osage Nation members for their oil-rich land in the 1920s, is in many ways far outside Mr. Scorsese鈥檚 own experience. But as a story of trust and betrayal 鈥� the film is centered on the loving yet treacherous relationship between Mollie Kyle (Lily Gladstone), a member of a larger Osage family, and Ernest Burkhart (Leonardo DiCaprio), a World War I veteran who comes to work for his corrupt uncle (Robert De Niro) 鈥� it鈥檚 a profoundly personal film that maps some of the themes of Mr. Scorsese鈥檚 gangster films onto American history.

Read the Monitor鈥檚 review of 鈥�Killers of the Flower Moon.鈥�

鈥淜illers of the Flower Moon,鈥� a $200-million, 206-minute epic produced by Apple that鈥檚 in theaters Friday, is an audacious big swing by Mr. Scorsese to continue his kind of ambitious, personal filmmaking on the largest scale at a time when such grand, big-screen statements are a rarity.

Mr. Scorsese considers 鈥淜illers of the Flower Moon鈥� to be 鈥渁n internal spectacle.鈥� The Oklahoma-set film, adapted from David Grann鈥檚 2017 bestseller, might be called his first Western. But while developing Mr. Grann鈥檚 book, which chronicles the Osage murders and the birth of the FBI, Mr. Scorsese came to the realization that centering the film on federal investigator Tom White was a familiar type of Western.

鈥淚 realized: 鈥榊ou don鈥檛 do that. Your Westerns are the Westerns you saw in the late 鈥�40s and early 鈥�50s, that鈥檚 it. [Director Sam] Peckinpah finished that. 鈥榃ild Bunch,鈥� that鈥檚 the end. Now they鈥檙e different,鈥� he says. 鈥淚t represented a certain time in who we were as a nation and a certain time in the world 鈥� and the end of the studio system. It was a genre. That folklore is gone.鈥�

Mr. Scorsese, after conversations with Leonardo DiCaprio, pivoted to the story of Ernest and Mollie and a perspective closer to the Osage Nation. Consultations with the tribe continued and expanded to include accurately capturing the language, traditional clothing, and customs.

鈥淚t鈥檚 historical that Indigenous Peoples can tell their story at this level. That鈥檚 never happened before as far as I know,鈥� says Geoffrey Standing Bear, principal chief of the Osage Nation. 鈥淚t took somebody who could know that we鈥檝e been betrayed for hundreds of years. He wrote a story about betrayal of trust.鈥�

鈥淜illers of the Flower Moon鈥� grew out of a period of reflection and re-evaluation for Mr. Scorsese during the pandemic. COVID-19, he says, was 鈥渁 gamechanger.鈥� For a filmmaker whose time is so intensely scheduled, the break was in some ways a relief, and it allowed him a chance to reconsider what he wants to dedicate himself to. For him, preparing a film is a meditative process.

鈥淚 don鈥檛 use a computer because I tried a couple times and I got very distracted. I get distracted as it is,鈥� Mr. Scorsese says. 鈥淚鈥檝e got films, I鈥檝e got books, I鈥檝e got people. I鈥檝e only begun this year to read emails. Emails, they scare me. It says 鈥楥C鈥� and there are a thousand names. Who are these people?鈥�

Mr. Scorsese has for years been the preeminent conscience of cinema, passionately arguing for the place of personal filmmaking in an era of moviegoing where films can be devalued as 鈥渃ontent,鈥� theater screens are monopolized by Marvel, and big-screen vision can be shrunk down on streaming platforms.

鈥淚鈥檓 trying to keep alive the sense that cinema is an artform,鈥� Mr. Scorsese says. 鈥淭he next generation may not see it that way because as children and younger people, they鈥檙e exposed to films that are wonderful entertainment, beautifully made, but are purely diversionary. I think cinema can enrich your life.鈥�

鈥淎s I鈥檓 leaving, I鈥檓 trying to say: Remember, this can really be something beautiful in your life.鈥�

Cinema, he says, may be the preeminent 20th-century artform, but something else will belong to the 21st century. Now, Mr. Scorsese says, 鈥渢he visual image could be done by anything by anybody anytime anywhere.鈥�

The pressure of time is weighing more heavily on Mr. Scorsese, too. He has, he鈥檚 said, maybe two more feature films left in him. Currently in the mix are an adaptation of Mr. Grann鈥檚 latest book, the 18th-century shipwreck tale 鈥淭he Wager, 鈥� and an adaptation of Marilynne Robinson鈥檚 鈥淗ome.鈥�

Yet Mr. Scorsese says he often feels like he鈥檚 in a race to accomplish what he can with the time he has left. Increasingly, he's prioritizing what鈥檚 worth it. Some things are easier for him to give up.

鈥淲ould I like to do more? Yeah. Would I like to go to everybody鈥檚 parties and dinner parties and things? Yeah, but you know what? I think I know enough people,鈥� Mr. Scorsese says with a laugh. 鈥淲ould I like to go see the ancient Greek ruins? Yes. Go back to Sicily? Yes. Go back to Naples again? Yes. North Africa? Yes. But I don鈥檛 have to.鈥�

Time for Mr. Scorsese may be waning but curiosity is as abundant as ever.

鈥淚f I鈥檓 curious about something, I think I鈥檒l find a way 鈥� if I hold out, if I hold up 鈥� to try to make something about it on film,鈥� he says. 鈥淢y curiosity is still there.鈥�

This story was reported by The Associated Press.